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Written by
Leor Zmigrod
Open Cognition
Eric Olander
The China-Global South Project
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General Update

Conversation Changers: The Radical Science of Flexible Thinking

Salzburg Global Gellow Leor Zmigrod explains the neuroscience behind extremism on the newest podcast episode of Conversation Changers

Published date
Written by
Leor Zmigrod
Open Cognition
Eric Olander
The China-Global South Project
Share
a graphic card introducing the Conversation Changers episode on "The Radical Science of Flexible Thinking"

Conversation Changers, Salzburg Global's podcast, brings together thought leaders, artists, policymakers, and change-makers from around the globe to reframe dialogue, explore new ideas, and imagine better futures.

"The conversation I'd like to change is the one that constantly celebrates having rigid convictions... having a rigid ideology is not a prerequisite for being moral in the world." — Leor Zmigrod
 

In the season two premiere of Conversation Changers, host Eric Olander explores the profound connection between our biological makeup and our political beliefs. While we often blame social media algorithms for the "echo chambers" of modern life, research suggests that the root of extremism might actually lie within the neural pathways of the human brain.

Eric is joined by Leor Zmigrod, a world-renowned political neuroscientist, to discuss her groundbreaking work on cognitive rigidity. Together, they examine how our mental capacity to adapt to change and uncertainty - or our struggle to do so - predicts our susceptibility to dogmatic and extreme ideologies.

Highlights From This Episode:

  • The Spectrum of Rigidity: Everyone sits on a spectrum from highly flexible to highly rigid thinkers, a trait that can be measured through simple neuropsychological games rather than self-reporting.
  • Childhood Origins: Levels of cognitive flexibility are visible as early as age nine or ten, influenced by both inborn dispositions and the parental environment.
  • The Routine Trap: Why repeating the same habits and routines every day can actually hinder your brain's capacity to think "outside the box" and adapt to new information.
  • Identity and Dehumanisation: How fusing personal identity with rigid politics can lead to the dehumanisation of others and, ultimately, oneself.
  • Nurturing Resilience: Practical advice on infusing life with creativity and "bending the rules" to build intellectual resilience against extremist narratives.

Continue the Conversation

Click here to subscribe to Conversation Changers on your favorite podcast platform and join the conversation on social media using #ConversationChangers and tag @SalzburgGlobal.

Follow Leor Zmigrod on LinkedIn and explore her book, The Ideological Brain.

Follow Eric Olander on LinkedIn.

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General
Leor Zmigrod

Leor Zmigrod is a political psychologist and neuroscientist, and author of The Ideological Brain. Her research centers on what makes some individuals most susceptible to extreme and dogmatic ideologies. She studied at Cambridge University as a Gates Scholar before winning a Junior Research Fellowship at Churchill College, Cambridge. She has held visiting fellowships at Stanford, Harvard, and both the Berlin and Paris Institutes for Advanced Study. She was listed on ‘Forbes 30 Under 30’ in Science and has won numerous prizes, including the Women of the Future Science Award and the Glushko Prize. Her popular science book The Ideological Brain reveals the psychological and neurobiological traits that predispose some minds to extremism as well as the ways in which immersion in rigid ideologies might transform our brains and bodies. The book is being translated into over 15 languages and has been recognized as one of the most hotly anticipated non-fiction books of 2025 by The Guardian, The Los Angeles Times, New Scientist, and Financial Times.

Eric Olander

Eric is the Editor-in-Chief of The China-Global South Project, bringing over 30 years of journalism experience across global newsrooms, including CNN, FRANCE 24, and the BBC World Service. His career spans reporting, production, and newsroom leadership in the United States, Europe, Africa, and Asia. He notably served as General Director of FBNC, Vietnam's largest all-business cable TV channel, becoming the first foreigner to lead a national Vietnamese media company. Eric holds a bachelor's degree in East African history from the University of California, Berkeley, and a Master's in International Public Affairs with a focus on Chinese foreign policy from the University of Hong Kong. Eric is a Salzburg Global Fellow.

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